miss out on two very good analyses of the moral and financial dilemnas faced by those caught up in the sand states RE mess...
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However, as we point out to Megan, she missed something.
Large.
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JGBHimself
First, your "friends" in the mortgage & investment banking industry created US$ 2.5 Trillion in very bad ARMs and subprime RE mortgages in the sand states of Cal, Nev, fla and AZ.
ALL of those bad RE loans are now more than 50% underwater, in or already back out of foreclosure, or through BKs.
Some 85% of those bad RE loans are now defunct in the sand states.
THEY NO LONGER EXIST.
Second, most of those RE loans were "speculative", and there were two kinds of them.
As a new NY Fed report shows U.S. most of them were "investors", buying multiple homes speculating on the huge appreciated values.
ALL OF THOSE PEOPLE HAVE LONG SINCE WALKED AWAY FROM THEIR BAD INVESTMENTS
The other "speculators" were those with no reason to buy those home - except that with nothing down, no payments and doing nothing except making Countrywide, WAMU, Wichovia, and New Century very rich.., expected to become very rich themselves by selling a hugely appreciated home in a couple'a years.
THOSE PEOPLE HAVE LONG SINCE LOST THEIR HOMES
So, Megan, WHO, precisely, is left out there?
Third, surrounding those bad ARMs and subprimes are people who obtained "conventional" RE loans - put down 20% in order to buy a home in order to work at Boeing or Intel in AZ.
Beginning school teachers, firemen, and police officers, too.
As they say in Canada,... those people are really Pucked.
But, of course, you don't give a GD about "Those People" do you Megan?
Fourth, all of the miscreants you condemn to financial death have already walked, Scot free
The only ones left, that appear to offend you, are those who played by the rules you say should be "inviolate".
WAMU's Kerry Kissinger will really love you, Megan.
Those People will not.
ALL of those bad RE loans are now more than 50% underwater, in or already back out of foreclosure, or through BKs.
Some 85% of those bad RE loans are now defunct in the sand states.
THEY NO LONGER EXIST.
Second, most of those RE loans were "speculative", and there were two kinds of them.
As a new NY Fed report shows U.S. most of them were "investors", buying multiple homes speculating on the huge appreciated values.
ALL OF THOSE PEOPLE HAVE LONG SINCE WALKED AWAY FROM THEIR BAD INVESTMENTS
The other "speculators" were those with no reason to buy those home - except that with nothing down, no payments and doing nothing except making Countrywide, WAMU, Wichovia, and New Century very rich.., expected to become very rich themselves by selling a hugely appreciated home in a couple'a years.
THOSE PEOPLE HAVE LONG SINCE LOST THEIR HOMES
So, Megan, WHO, precisely, is left out there?
Third, surrounding those bad ARMs and subprimes are people who obtained "conventional" RE loans - put down 20% in order to buy a home in order to work at Boeing or Intel in AZ.
Beginning school teachers, firemen, and police officers, too.
As they say in Canada,... those people are really Pucked.
But, of course, you don't give a GD about "Those People" do you Megan?
Fourth, all of the miscreants you condemn to financial death have already walked, Scot free
The only ones left, that appear to offend you, are those who played by the rules you say should be "inviolate".
WAMU's Kerry Kissinger will really love you, Megan.
Those People will not.
------------
JGBHimself
Setting aside, for the moment, that your first article merely set up a "straw man" so you could return and appear to be "a reasonable man"...
What you still did not address is The Fact that in the Great Recession, in the bubble boom sand states, the worst of the worst have already skated away scott free - both the sneaky investors and the other "po' 'ol" scofflaws.
Now, after all the really bad guys got away..., you think that morally the door should have been closed, on them. How nice. And, so timely.
And, you think that morally any one left is reprehensible for doing what they got away with.
At least we know which side you are on.
Today, the SEC charges the Execs of FMae and FMac. How nice is that.
As W would say to them:
"WE didn't promise YOU a Rose Garden!
when we "nationalized" you for the Chinese!"
Where, however, are the SEC charges filed against the Exec of the Wall Street banksters who floated US$ 2.5 Trillion worth of very bad ARMs and subprimes on U.S.?
With those loans now worth less than 50 cents on the dollar, so, in about 3 years they skewered (sp?) U.S. out of more than US$ 1.25 Trillion.
And, they weren't even Congressmen.
Where are the SEC charges filed against the Execs of Countrywide, WAMU, Wichovia and New Century who "originated" all those terrible RE loans?
And, WAMU's Kerry Killinger & two other execs "get off" for only US$ 64 million - about 2o million each - paid by WaMu's directors' and officers' (D&O) insurance?
So, you think some poor smuck paying on a 50% underwater RE conventional loan, they got paying 20% down at the highth of the bubble, would be IM-moral (as in not) to take a walk?
Kerry will truly LOVE you, Megan...; the rest of U.S. not
=======What you still did not address is The Fact that in the Great Recession, in the bubble boom sand states, the worst of the worst have already skated away scott free - both the sneaky investors and the other "po' 'ol" scofflaws.
Now, after all the really bad guys got away..., you think that morally the door should have been closed, on them. How nice. And, so timely.
And, you think that morally any one left is reprehensible for doing what they got away with.
At least we know which side you are on.
Today, the SEC charges the Execs of FMae and FMac. How nice is that.
As W would say to them:
"WE didn't promise YOU a Rose Garden!
when we "nationalized" you for the Chinese!"
Where, however, are the SEC charges filed against the Exec of the Wall Street banksters who floated US$ 2.5 Trillion worth of very bad ARMs and subprimes on U.S.?
With those loans now worth less than 50 cents on the dollar, so, in about 3 years they skewered (sp?) U.S. out of more than US$ 1.25 Trillion.
And, they weren't even Congressmen.
Where are the SEC charges filed against the Execs of Countrywide, WAMU, Wichovia and New Century who "originated" all those terrible RE loans?
And, WAMU's Kerry Killinger & two other execs "get off" for only US$ 64 million - about 2o million each - paid by WaMu's directors' and officers' (D&O) insurance?
So, you think some poor smuck paying on a 50% underwater RE conventional loan, they got paying 20% down at the highth of the bubble, would be IM-moral (as in not) to take a walk?
Kerry will truly LOVE you, Megan...; the rest of U.S. not
Why Shouldn't People Just Default?
http://www.theatlantic.com/
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So When Should You Default on Your Mortgage?
http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2011/12/so-when-should-you-default-on-your-mortgage/250071/
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Steven, we think that Bill@CR pointed out to U.S. that "voluntary quits" are now trending up. And, that "mass layoffs" and other "terminations" are declining.